My guest for this episode is Lexi B, a tech veteran, professional speaker, and the founder and community builder of Sista Circle: Black Women in Tech. Lexi and I discuss how she learned to “strategically scream,” which helped her find her voice, the importance of knowing your worth outside work, her “why” and her LinkedIn Live series.
Lexi didn’t go to college thinking about tech, as she majored in communications and Spanish. But soon after graduating, Lexi got a job as an engineering program manager “and then really just started building my career, figuring out the things that I do like on a day-to-day basis, the things that I don’t like on the day-to-day basis,” she says, “but also, most importantly, how I will be treating myself and how I expect others to treat me at work.”
Today, Lexi is the employee experience lead at Upside, a retail tech company. But beyond her day job, she’s dedicated to helping companies support their workforces through four pillars: “that the people that I work with are seen, heard, valued and paid equitably.”
Punk Rock HR is proudly underwritten by Betterworks. The world’s most dynamic organizations rely on Betterworks to accelerate growth by supporting transparent goal setting, enabling continuous performance and learning from employee insights. Betterworks is on a mission to help HR leaders make work better. Discover how they can help you by visiting www.betterworks.com.
Learning to ‘Strategically Scream’
Lexi identifies as a Black woman with roots in the American South. In her first tech job, Lexi was often the only woman and only Black person in the room — and oftentimes was also the youngest.
Across these identities, Lexi constantly heard from colleagues that no one else was in the room like her. These interactions helped Lexi realize that she had to advocate for herself to thrive in her career. Doing that effectively was an evolving process.
“So I was hollering at work. It probably was not the best way to handle things, but I was just trying to be heard,” Lexi shares. “And then I would find people who wanted to mentor me and say, ‘I hear you. You got to stop screaming this way. This is how you strategically scream.’”
Learning to “strategically scream” led Lexi to embrace “freedom fighting” — for herself and others. This led to her asking the head of her department for funding to create a program that connected college graduates like herself. The success of this program helped Lexi see the importance of advocacy and creating a sense of belonging.
“It was the first time as well, where I realized that closed mouths don’t get fed,” she says. “And more often than not, me asking for $10,000 to motivate the 22- to 23-, 24-year-old population at my company isn’t a lot of money for a company. It’s an easy effort to keep us somewhat happy.”
Consciously Uncoupling and Knowing Your Worth
“Strategic screaming’ doesn’t always work. So what do you do then, especially when people try to pass something off as just the way business works? Lexi wants people to understand that “business is intrinsically personal.” And sometimes, that means moving on to protect yourself and your bank account.
“I was at my first job for four and a half years, and it was learning and unlearning these practices,” Lexi says. “It was learning and unlearning that, ‘Oh, so I just don’t have to fight anymore. I can just go someplace else.’ And to be very transparent. I didn’t know that for a long time.”
A LinkedIn message from a recruiter helped Lexi understand her value — and how people outside the organization viewed her.
“I knew that I did stuff. I knew there were words on my LinkedIn that sounded good,” she explains. “But no one ever pieced together those pieces to say, ‘You say you like to do this and you say you’re good at this. If you add those two things together, I think you’d be great at this job.’ No one did that at my job, and this random woman in Chicago, she did that.”
While she didn’t get that job, the experience helped Lexi focus on moving on in her career. “My value is not here. You don’t see my value. So I’m just going to consciously uncouple and go to another place that may see my value and grow me,” she says.
Embracing Her “Why”
Everyone has a “why” that motivates them. Lexi’s is very specific.
“I am a creative person in nature. I want to be able to create things where there’s an intersection of literal arts and activism,” she says. “I want to have amazing conversations like this one on a daily basis of ‘Why do we act the way that we act, and how can we unlearn those things?’”
One way Lexi is achieving her “why” is through her six-week LinkedIn Live audio program. Lexi has intimate, candid conversations about careers, purpose, and topics that aren’t being discussed enough.
“The live show is a weekly one-hour show with a thought leader or someone who does phenomenal work in their space,” she says. “We’ll talk about a theme and a lesson that they would talk about with their friends or their kid, or with someone they’re close to, but on a public stage.”
People in This Episode
Lexi B: LinkedIn, Twitter, Instagram, Sista Circle: Black Women in Tech
Transcript
Laurie Ruettimann:
Punk Rock HR is sponsored by Betterworks. The world’s most dynamic organizations rely on Betterworks to accelerate growth by supporting transparent goal setting, enabling continuous performance, and learning from employee insights. Betterworks is on a mission to help HR leaders make work better. Discover how they can help you by visiting Betterworks.com today.
Hey, everybody. I’m Laurie Ruettimann. Welcome back to Punk Rock HR. My guest this week is Lexi B. She’s a tech industry veteran who has worked at some major organizations, some brands that you know and you use, but she’s also someone who thinks critically about the world of work, and that’s what we’re talking about today. Lexi brings all of her experiences, all of her ideas, all of her interactions to the podcast today and gives us a lesson on how we can think about the world of work a little differently. So if you’re interested in meeting someone new, someone cool, someone who is really breaking barriers in the world of work, well, sit back and enjoy this conversation with Lexi B on this week’s Punk Rock HR.
Hey, Lexi. Welcome to the podcast.
Lexi B:
Thank you. How are you?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, I’m thrilled you’re here. That’s how I’m doing. And for those who don’t know who you are and what you’re all about, could you maybe tell us the Lexi B origin story?
Lexi B:
Yes. So I’m Lexi B. I was born and raised in St. Louis, Missouri, which is a big part of my life. Came out to the Bay Area to go to college and accidentally stumbled into the tech industry. That was not the goal, Laurie, in any capacity, but if you want to make the ancestors laugh, tell them your plans. And so started working in tech as an engineering program manager at 22, not knowing what any of those things were, while also just navigating the adulting process, which I do not think that we discuss enough in this world about how difficult that is. And then really just started building my career, figuring out the things that I do like on a day-to-day basis, the things that I don’t like on the day-to-day basis, but also, most importantly, how I will be treating myself and how I expect others to treat me at work.
And so I’ve worked at many companies, a lot of them huge consumer brands, in various places, whether it’s employee engagement or legal policy, trust and safety, engineering, but really this foundation of making sure that the people that I work with are seen, heard, valued and paid equitably. Because I believe that if all those four pillars are there, then we can do actually anything, because anything can be taught.
Laurie Ruettimann:
You’re an optimist, you’re a dreamer, but I would also imagine that you’ve learned some hard-fought lessons in your career, especially being a woman and a woman of color in the tech industry. So wait, before I give those labels to you, how do you identify yourself?
Lexi B:
I identify myself as a Black woman whose roots are based in the American South. My ancestors were enslaved West African bodies that came over to the United States. And I say that so honestly and so militantly because, first and foremost, Black is not a monolith, and especially in the United States, I think that many times people assume that we are. My husband is Nigerian, so he and I have a different perspective and angle of what Blackness is and how it relates to society, which is a beautiful thing. So that’s how I identify myself.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, and also being a woman isn’t a monolith, either. I mean, it’s not like a statement that applies the same way to everybody who identifies as a woman. And I think that’s just also an interesting perspective that you bring. You work at this intersection, and you work in the tech industry, and if I may just reveal what’s on your LinkedIn profile, you have worked for one of the most controversial tech companies in the past 25 years.
You worked at Twitter, so that’s right at the intersection of a hotbed of topics around identity, race, gender, sex, national origin, religion, all of this is being discussed in Twitter, outside of Twitter, but Twitter’s at the ecosystem of that right now.
Lexi B:
Twitter itself is a fantastic platform. I remember interviewing for Twitter, and they said, “Why do you want to work here, because this is a crazy place? Why would anyone want to work in this crazy place?”
Laurie Ruettimann:
It was crazy before the current administration. Yes, yes.
Lexi B:
Yes. This was years before the current administration. It was crazy then. And I told them, I said, “I want to be part of figuring out how to continually have a town hall, how to continually allow people to speak their truth and speak it in a way that is not violent towards other people, but they can say what they want to say.”
I also think that this idea and the platform itself is so transformative. We are in a part of our lives as a society that things literally no longer happen without Twitter. I remember the World Cup, and it was happening right as this new regime was happening at Twitter, and inside the company, it said, “Can we literally support the World Cup?” We were having conversations with multiple teams and entities because they were like, “So how is this going to work?” And the fact that you’re having those conversations, the fact that when I was there having conversations with political entities of like, “Yo, you can support the number of tweets that are going to happen during this election because Twitter can’t crash.”
When I was growing up, elections still happened, but nobody was leaning on Twitter. And to be at a company where you innately knew that if this thing did not work tomorrow during this very major election, a political election for ABC company, it could actually have huge negative consequences to the fairness of that election. And that is wild and crazy and so fascinating at the same time.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, I mean, you have really seen a lot in your esteemed career, and I find that interesting because now one of the ways that you identify yourself is as a freedom fighter. So can you tell me what that is? What does that mean to you?
Lexi B:
I can also give you some background to that. When I joined the tech industry — and just to reiterate, tech is all that I know, so when I literally was 22, three weeks out of undergrad, just joining a job —
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, yeah. Wait, what’d you study in undergrad?
Lexi B:
I was a communications and Spanish major.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Of course, of course you were. Did you like theater, as well, because that’s perfect for the tech industry as well?
Lexi B:
I did a lot of theater growing up, actually. I did a lot of musical theater growing up. And it’s funny to me how my musical theater background definitely directly helps me more at work than sometimes my Spanish degree.
Laurie Ruettimann:
I believe that. I believe that. Yes.
Lexi B:
So I joined this industry. I don’t necessarily, in my opinion, think of it as tech yet, because I’m just like, “I don’t know what’s going on, but I need to get paid to pay rent. Let me see how I do the thing.” And it was a very stark awakening of my position and all of my identities, really just hitting at once for the first time in my life. Being the only Black human in the room, being the only woman in the room, and many times being the only Black woman in the room, I remember distinctly realizing my age, because when you’re an undergrad, you’re for the most part around the same age. When you were in elementary school, primary school, high school, you were all part of the same age group. And so going to work and having comments to me like, “Oh my gosh, my daughter’s your age.” And it was like, “OK, but what does that mean?”
Laurie Ruettimann:
Do you identify with a particular generation? Are you Gen X? Are you millennial?
Lexi B:
I’m technically a millennial. Being in this world where there was no one who was also like me, and in many ways being told every day that there was no one in this room who was like me. And so I realized very early on that in order for me to survive in my career — forget learning how to do my job, which is important — I’m going to have to learn how to advocate for myself because there is no way that I can do this and actually learn how to do my job but not advocate for myself without either A, getting fired, because people will change the narrative that is not true. Or B, myself just burning out and having a mental breakdown because I feel like no one hears me. So I just started screaming.
Laurie Ruettimann:
I mean, screaming is the right thing to do, and you’re also doing it early in your career in the absence of really helpful LinkedIn Learning courses or online training or people coming in and really doing some great training through the diversity department. So none of that existed when you emerged into the workforce, so you were really a trailblazer in doing this. So how does that move from being a trailblazer to being a freedom fighter?
Lexi B:
What happened was I started doing things that I thought would help me, and my grandmother used to always say, “A hit dog will holler.” And so I was hollering at work, Laurie, and probably not the best way to handle things, but I was just trying to be heard. And then I would find people who wanted to mentor me and say, “I hear you. You got to stop screaming this way. This is how you strategically scream.”
And then what I did, I’ll never forget, I was at my first company, and I went to the head of engineering one day, who happened to work down the hall from me, who barely knew who I was. And I said, “I want $10,000 to build a new college grad program so all of us new college grads can meet each other.” And he said, “Why is that important?” And I told him, I said, “I’m tired of being in rooms and thinking that I’m the youngest person by a generation who works at this company. And I’m aware that I’m not because I see random people in the hallway that look my age.” And then we have this weird side eye and head nod. “But I want you to pay for me to meet them because I can’t be safe and seen in this environment if I don’t have people that are my age, and we can talk about things because we don’t know what we’re doing.” And he wrote the check.
And that was the first time that I realized, “Oh, so freedom fighting is this all-encompassing, not only figuring out what I need but then also requiring people to give it to the masses.” And so I started this social new college grad program, and we had a speaker series, and I kept asking for more money, and Laurie, they just magically gave it to me. So it was the first time, as well, where I realized that closed mouths don’t get fed. And more often than not, me asking for $10,000 to motivate the 22- to 23-, 24-year-old population at my company is not a lot of money for a company. It’s an easy effort to keep us somewhat happy.
And what happened with that was then, building relationships with high-ranking people at the company and starting to really build my career based on the things that I wanted to do and getting to know people and starting to fill in those gaps of, “Oh, this is what I’m missing that you refuse to give me.” And I always tell people like, “Do not crack open a door for me because I will bulldoze through that door.” And when I got that $10,000 check to start that programming, they cracked open the door.
And I said, never again will I be in a situation where I feel silent because I’m not getting what I need. I’m going to ask for it. I’m going to require it. And if you say no, I’m just going to go get it from someone else because it’s my life that I have to live. It’s not your life, it’s my life. And so how can I freedom fight for other people who are missing those gaps as well, and may or may not know how to strategically get what they want in corporate spaces?
Laurie Ruettimann:
I find this concept of strategic screaming so fascinating because, in certain areas, this is going to work, right? You modulate your request, you try to make a business case, but you’re still you, and you still bring all of that to it. And I think, in other situations, you could strategically scream your head off, you can mask, you can code switch, you can do all the things you need to do, and you’re still not going to make a dent. So how do you fight against that pervasive pushback that a lot of people are feeling? How do you make sure it doesn’t erode your sense of worth, your self-esteem? How do you guard against taking it personally?
Lexi B:
So number one, business is personal because it’s about our money. And I always tell people that. I’m like, “Whoever said business wasn’t personal, they lied.” Business is intrinsically personal because my bank account is very personal, and I have yet to work for someone, regardless of color, creed or where they come from, where their bank account is also not personal to them. So business is very personal.
I am the kind of person, I’ve been very fortunate to have a lot of mentors and people in my life that just love on me and give me so much advice. And all of them have always told me, you will know when you’re done fighting, when it’s not working, because you can go someplace else. And that is very, very big, and that is very hard to understand. And I think that capitalism doesn’t want people to know that. But this is a two-way street. And there have been many times in my career where I have fought, I have tried, and the definition of chaos is doing the same thing in assuming you’re going to get the same result. At a certain point in time, in order for you to preserve your worth, right? Because if you continue trying to fight and it has the same result that is oppressing you, at some point you’re like, “Am I crazy? Maybe I’m the wrong one.”
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, my friend Minda Harts calls that trauma. Yeah, yeah.
Lexi B:
Minda Harts! I love Minda Harts.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Oh, God, amazing. Yeah.
Lexi B:
She’s fantastic. That is the trauma. And so I think after my first job, I was at my first job for four and a half years, and it was learning and unlearning these practices. It was learning and unlearning that, “Oh, so I just don’t have to fight anymore. I can just go someplace else.” And to be very transparent. I didn’t know that, Laurie, for a long time.
In those four and a half years that I was at that company doing all this great freedom fighting work for new college grads, I was also suffering because I felt as though my career was being stifled. Nobody was listening to me, no one was giving me opportunities to do great work. And also nobody was taking me into a conference room and saying, “This is what you’re good at.”
And what happened was a pivotal moment I will never forget. It was November 2015, and I got a LinkedIn message from a Black woman who was a recruiter at another company based in Chicago, and she said, “We should talk. I would love to talk about a new job.” And Laura, you never say no to a LinkedIn message.
I found a conference room away from my desk, and we had a 20-minute conversation, and it took this random human to tell me my worth. I didn’t know my worth. I knew that I did stuff. I knew there were words in my LinkedIn that sounded good. I don’t know. But no one ever pieced together those puzzles to say, “You say you like to do this, you say you’re good at this. If you add those two things together, I think you’d be great at this job.” No one did that at my job, and this random woman in Chicago, on a phone call for 15 minutes, she did that, and she invited me to interview, and she flew me to Chicago for the interview. And guess what? I did horrible at the interview, and I didn’t get the job, but that’s not the point.
The point was is that this is now December 2015. I remember being at home for Christmas with my parents, and my dad said, “So what are we doing?” And I looked at him and I said, “I don’t know what I’m going to do, but this woman in Chicago said, I’m good at something.” And even though I didn’t get this job, January 2016, y’all about to see a different Lexi because someone just told me that all these skills that I know that I have and all the things that I like to do, they puzzled it together. And so since she did that, it’s a wrap. And I came in 2016 as a new person and started looking for a new job because I was like, “My value is not here. You don’t see my value. So I’m just going to consciously uncouple and go to another place that may see my value and grow me.”
Laurie Ruettimann:
It’s real interesting when I talk to individuals who are millennials, right? I’m Gen X, and there’s always this link, intentionally or not, between work and worth. And I think, for me, it took me aging a little bit to realize that capitalism holds no place for me, and no matter how hard I work, I cannot tie my worth to my job. And yet I need to work, right? I’m not born of wealth, and I don’t have a silver spoon, and nobody’s just writing me a check. But I had to find a way to understand that nobody was going to tell me anything about this world. In fact, they were going to purposely put obstacles in front of me so that they could build up their own bank accounts, and they can build up their own self-worth through viewing it through work.
And I say this with all the privileges that I have, right? So I just wonder, are we ever going to get to a place where work is going to be this promised land where we can work at the intersection of purpose and meaning, where we can do great things and still be human? Because I think if that’s the place we’re trying to go, my God, Lexi, we’re never going to get there. We’re never going to get there. Capitalism is not going to allow for it. But with all of that being said, what’s your take on that?
Lexi B:
Yeah, capitalism is king. So number one, I am a realistic optimist —
Laurie Ruettimann:
OK, yeah.
Lexi B:
— if we’re going to get more complex about it. I think that we can get there, but it really starts within us. I think that we really have to dismantle these capitalistic ideologies — that all of us have by the way, that are ingrained in us even when our parents didn’t want that to happen. I always tell people, “Capitalism seeps in when you go home for a major holiday, and that one uncle says, ‘Hey, Laurie, so how’s the job? I told all my friends at the bingo club that you work for X company'” That’s capitalism. Your elder, who you love and who loves you, so he is not saying this to oppress you on purpose, basically just told you that he told all of his friends that your worth is baked into you working for this company that all his friends know about. And that’s how it starts.
For us to dismantle that idea, for us to be able to walk around the world and do great work with purpose, everyone has to learn what their worth is, and they have to know how to communicate that. A lot of people that I mentor, I always tell them, “Most people are not working at these companies because this is their lifelong goal, this is their dream.” Most people aren’t even dreaming. We have been kidnapped of dreaming from capitalism. What happens when we require people to dream? What happens when we tell adults the same story like we tell 5-year-olds? Like when you have a 5-year-old like, “What are you going to be when you grow up?” And your 5-year-old’s like, “I want to be an astronaut, baker, ballerina.” And you’re like, “Yes.”
But then when you become 22, if you give the same answer, people look at you like, “That’s not real.” But what happens if that can be real? What happens if we start mentoring people and decoupling where they work and how much money they make with “What do you want your life to look like?” Great. OK. Based on what you want your life to look like, this is how much money it needs to get to that feet of the mountain, and this is how much work it requires. Does that still sound good to you? Fantastic. How can we make that happen for you? How can we make sure that you’re working at a company that gets you to that? Because there’s many companies out in the world. How about we strategically pick the company that actually aligns with that dream?
Laurie Ruettimann:
That’s interesting that you describe it that way, because I think that’s very realistic. There are limitations in our society, and in that way, capitalism is also about scarcity. There’s a binary. You have to make a choice. I would love a world where someone could dream about being a caregiver. Someone could dream about working with animals and not having to worry about, “Can I make rent?” or, “Can I pay for my health care?” But I also want people to just dream of art. We don’t do enough of that. And I think if we did more of that, we actually may get better engineers, better programmers, better pharmacists, but we just focus on the skills-based economy that we rob people of their ability to be creative. And so I like where you’re going with all this, but I don’t know, I’m still really depressed, Lexi, about capitalism.
Lexi B:
So Laurie, I am innately depressed about capitalism. Let’s be very clear. I am very sad all the time, and I’ll be taking this jovially, but to be very honest, I am a product of capitalism. My ancestors were the free labor to build this capitalist society. So I always tell people, like, “My existence is the trauma of capitalism.” So I’m definitely not a fan. I love how you said, “I want a world where people dream about art and dream about color and dream in music and in rhythm and in rhyme,” because I do agree with you. What if that was prioritized? You would actually build better stuff.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, a hundred percent. You’d get people who could design, who could think, who can see the forest for the trees. You could get all of the things that we’re trying to do through teaching to a stink and test like how our society is structured. So I think we’re aligned, and I understand why our dear common friend Nick Morgan introduced us, and you’ve really stressed the importance of people understanding their why and what happens if they don’t understand their why. So I’m going to ask you something. Do you know your why right now?
Lexi B:
I do know my why. I joke with people all the time, and I say, “My why is to be Black, blessed, lotioned and left alone.” And though it comes off as a jovial thing, it’s actually very true. I want to be able to wake up and be able to create because it soothes me. I am a creative person in nature. I want to be able to create things where there’s an intersection of literal arts and activism. I want to have amazing conversations like this one on a daily basis of “Why do we act the way that we act, and how can we unlearn those things?” That’s my why. And so what I’m doing currently in my career is I am actively finding places and spaces and managers that I can do that in my day-to-day work while doing my actual deliverables, because the mortgage check is due every first of the month, Laurie.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Mine is due today. I just wrote that check today. So I mean, it’s real.
Lexi B:
See, there is a [inaudible 00:21:54]
Laurie Ruettimann:
But I mean, your dream doesn’t sound jovial. It sounds divine. It sounds luscious. It sounds deserved, quite honestly. We all deserve that just by being born. This idea that somehow we have to work and prove our worth is so grating and so nauseating to me at this point in my career. So I’m glad we have individuals like you who are out there fighting the good fight. And you currently share your message on LinkedIn in the audio spaces. Tell me more about that.
Lexi B:
Yes, so I currently have this LinkedIn audio live show that was accidentally concepted. Last year, I was part of the LinkedIn Creators program, which is a six-week program where LinkedIn requires you to create intentional content three times a week. I never considered myself a content creator. I was always the person that didn’t say much, and then something hit the news and I was like, “Oh, we got to talk about this.” And then I would just go into my hole and talk to my friends about it. And so when I got into this program and it required me to do this, I started thinking about the kinds of things I want to talk about.
Laurie, when I look at my career and I look at not the companies that I worked for or the work that I did, when I think about what actually propelled me to be successful in that moment, it wasn’t the work, it wasn’t the company, it was that one coffee chat or one conference talk in a conference room with this one person who told me the truth. I have been very blessed and fortunate to have people in my life that have loved me so much, they have told me the truth — and not in a negative way, in a loving way.
I remember this guy named Mark in my first company, and he saw that I was flailing at program management because, remember, I didn’t know what it was. And he took me to lunch one day, and he said, “Listen, this is what you’re going to do. You’re going to do this, you’re going to do this, you’re going to do this, then you’re going to send it to me, and I’m going to grade it, and we’re going to do this until you can get A-pluses every single week.”
It’s those kind of conversations. It’s the conversation that I had with another person when I was at another company, where something was going on in the conference room, and it was very racist and very misogynist, and you could tell from my body language this wasn’t OK. And that person pulled me aside and said, “It’s not OK, but this is how you’re going to handle it for the long term because this person, for whatever reason, is loved by leadership. So you yelling at them and saying they’re racist is actually not going to help you, but this is how we’re going to do this so you can actually get what you need and just not work with this person ever again.”
And it’s those conversations that have actually made me successful. And so I wanted to find a way of how can we take those intimate one-on-ones, that I think a lot of people have with their mentors that no one discusses publicly, and how can we make them public?
So the live show is that weekly one hour with a thought leader or someone who does phenomenal work in their space, we’d love to have you join. And we’ll talk about a theme and a lesson that they would talk about with their friends or with their kid, or with someone they’re close to, but on a public stage. And it’s like, “Let’s get to the real, get the root. What is this lesson? How did you actually learn this lesson? Because we know that you learned it in a probably traumatic, difficult way. And why is this lesson really, really important? How do we humanize the experience of moving up in your career?”
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, Lexi. This is absolutely something we will include in the show notes. I’m so excited to share this story and to share your LinkedIn audio conversations with the audience here at Punk Rock HR. And I’m just so grateful to Nick Morgan that he’s like, “You know who you need to have on your podcast? You need to have Lexi B.” And dang it, he is absolutely right. So thanks again for joining us today on the show.
Lexi B:
Thank you.
Laurie Ruettimann:
If you’re interested in learning more about today’s show, you can visit punkrockhr.com. There you’ll find show notes, links, resources, and all the good stuff. Now, that’s all for today. Thanks for joining us, sharing this episode, and leaving thoughtful comments on Instagram and LinkedIn. We appreciate your support this and every week on Punk Rock HR.
You must be logged in to post a comment.