Welcome to a very special episode of Punk Rock HR. It’s our 200th episode, and I’m pleased to have my friend Don MacPherson join me at the mic to talk about something really important to me.
In October 2021, my beloved cat Emma came down with pancreatitis. It was painful, aggressive, and her little body couldn’t fight it off. And on October 20, 2021, Emma passed away. I was doing pretty well during COVID. Like everybody, I had my ups and downs, but I felt okay—until Emma died, and suddenly the world was flat and depressing. I didn’t know how to process what happened, especially during a time when we were experiencing so much trauma in the world.
So I sat with my feelings privately for what felt like a long time until I just had to do something— to call my husband’s employee assistance program (EAP). The EAP is a program where you can get free advice on mental health issues, grief, loss, caregiving. Over 70% of the organizations in America offer some sort of EAP program.
But pre-COVID, only about 10% of our workforce actually took advantage of this program, according to Unum. And while there aren’t concrete numbers post-COVID, even if half the people who had access to EAP took advantage of it, it still would not be enough.
That’s what Don and I talk about in this episode. We talk about the employee assistance program, what it feels like to use it, what works, and what can be improved.
My fundamental belief is that we fix work by fixing ourselves first. But beyond that, I think we can fix the world by fixing ourselves first. And that’s what I’m sharing with all of you today.
Punk Rock HR is proudly underwritten by The Starr Conspiracy. The Starr Conspiracy is a B2B marketing agency for innovative brands creating the future of workplace solutions. For more information, head over to thestarrconspiracy.com.
What is the EAP?
Most people understand the concept of therapy. But while traditional therapy often gets to the heart of problems by looking back, an employee assistance program (EAP) offers short-term tactical support you may need today.
Yes, EAP provides a more surface-level practice, but it’s more targeted. An EAP is something that companies can give you if you’re feeling stressed from your job. The program can either give you light therapy or work to find the right therapist for you.
You typically get three free sessions to talk about your specific concerns. While it can sometimes work, other times, it isn’t enough to address the underlying problem. If you decide to use this program, you won’t be charged for it, and it won’t be recorded through your insurance provider.
The EAP Process
Throughout my career, I’ve called EAP a couple of times.
I first learned about the EAP because of my human resources experience. When I was a human resources manager, I remember calling their 1-800 number for help with a difficult employee. That call triggered a process where they did help me with the situation.
But when it came to my grief over Emma’s death, I called them and said, “I need some help. I want to talk to someone. I’m feeling grief over a pet, and it’s weird. I’ve never felt this way.” Right after that call, they had me go online, create a profile, fill it out, say that I’m feeling pet grief and then call them back.
I was shocked by the ease that I experienced getting set up with a therapist and my three free sessions—free due to a coupon code sent in a secure email. But I understand that it can still be challenging to use EAP because it is super complicated.
When I finally talked to a provider, I was already in four different databases. Eventually, I spoke to a provider that took notes that I could access on another platform instead of the one I started on. I do believe that rebranding the EAP programs can help raise utilization rates. While there are vendors out there trying to change it, there is still work to do so employees can have a productive experience.
How the EAP Helped Me
I learned a lot from this process. I ended up using all three of the sessions, and in those sessions, I was reminded of a few things.
I always say that we fix work by fixing ourselves, but I lost touch with the continuous improvement that I encouraged others commit to. I became hyper-focused on work in response to COVID, Emma’s health, and because I was in a chaotic season of my life trying to sell my book. I was reminded that my work is not worth it.
I also remembered that the stuff I teach to people are tools that I can use as an individual. I encourage people in my coaching sessions to say when they feel uncomfortable, angry or sad, but I hadn’t been doing that independently. I had to start practicing what I preached and lead by example.
In the past three months, I can’t tell you how many times I’ve lectured people about using their EAP and told HR professionals, “If you don’t use it, how can you expect other people to use it.”
But I was being a hypocrite. I had to get honest with myself about how I was encouraging others but completely ignoring the importance of leading.
Who am I to tell another HR professional that their employee experience is a leading indicator of other people’s experiences if my own experience in the world is terrible? I’ve got to act on this. I’ve got to be a leader. And that’s exactly what I did.
[bctt tweet=”‘I was reminded that my work is not my worth.’ Join me and @MacPherson_D for a very special episode of #PunkRockHR!” via=”no”]
People in This Episode
- Don MacPherson: LinkedIn, 12 Geniuses website
Full Transcript
Laurie Ruettimann:
This episode of Punk Rock HR is sponsored by The Starr Conspiracy. The Starr Conspiracy is the B2B marketing agency for innovative brands creating the future of workplace solutions. For more information, head on over to thestarrconspiracy.com.
Hey everybody. I’m Laurie Ruettimann. Welcome back to a special episode of Punk Rock HR. Today is show 200, and I’m pleased to have my friend Don MacPherson join me at the mic to talk about something that’s really important to me.
Back in October of 2021, my beloved cat Emma came down with something called pancreatitis. It’s very painful. It’s very aggressive, and her little body couldn’t fight it off. And on October 20, 2021, Emma passed away. I had been doing pretty good during COVID. Like everybody, I’ve had my ups and downs, but I felt okay until Emma died, and suddenly the world was flat and depressing. And I didn’t know how to process this, especially compared to all the trauma that’s out there in the world. So I sat with it privately for what felt like a very long time until finally, I just had to do something.
And so I called my husband’s employee assistance program. The EAP is a program where you can get free advice on mental health issues, on grief, on loss, on caregiving, and over 70% of organizations in America offer some sort of EAP program. But in normal times, pre-COVID, according to Unum, less than 10% of our workforce took advantage of an employee assistance program. Now there are, are no concrete numbers post-COVID, but based on utilization rates and accessibility, even if half of the people who had access to EAP took advantage of it, it’s still not enough. So that’s what Don and I talk about today on the podcast. The employee assistance program, what it feels like to use it, what works and can be improved. And my fundamental belief is that we fix work by fixing ourselves first, but beyond that, I think we fix the world by fixing ourselves first. And that’s what I wanted to share with all of you today.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Hey, Don, welcome to a very special podcast.
Don MacPherson:
Thank you for having me back, Laurie. Congratulations on your 200th episode.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Boy, it goes fast, doesn’t it? Didn’t it just seem like yesterday we were talking about maybe we should start podcasts?
Don MacPherson:
Yeah. And four years go by just like that.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Here we are. I mean, it’s really weird. Well, to get everybody started, why don’t you tell us who you are and what you’re all about?
Don MacPherson:
Well, like I said, I’m Don MacPherson, and I started a company called 12 Geniuses four years ago after leaving my corporate job. I worked at Aon for a couple of years after they acquired a company that I started back in 1999 with two business partners called Modern Survey. So I’ve been working in this HR space, helping people and companies improve the employee experience. And that’s my interest, that’s my passion, is to improve people’s lives by improving work. So we have alignment there in what we’re doing and outside of work, which there’s a lot of that now. I’m a father of two. I love to travel, and I spend a lot of time mentoring young people.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, I certainly have known you for longer than these four years. You and I met on the banks of the Mississippi River in what year was that, 2000 and what?
Don MacPherson:
It must have been 2011 because I had just moved into a condo across the river. And that was the backdrop of our discussion.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, we met because you were running Modern Survey. That was your organization. And you asked randomly to come and do a video since I was going to be in Minneapolis to talk about, I don’t know, employee engagement or something, I don’t even remember, but I remember going to lunch with you afterwards thinking, “I got to get to know this guy. He’s on to something.” And we’ve been friends since then. You make an appearance in my book, and I just love everything you’re all about. You’ve always been a good friend, a good mentor, and you’re here today to lead me through a discussion on, I don’t know, what life is like in COVID. I thought we would do that for the 200th podcast. What do you think about that?
Don MacPherson:
We’ll look back to March 11 or March 13, 2020, as the beginning of this journey or downward spiral or new normal, however you want to call it. And it’s two years of uncertainty and starts and stops. It’s been very challenging for everybody, opportunistic for some people, but not knowing what’s next is troubling for most people. And I’m just curious, how has it been for you? How are you doing?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, when COVID first started, I was kind of relieved, I have to say. A lot of events canceled, and I had financial obligations and all of that, but I was relieved that I was safe, that I was partnered with someone who cared about me, that we had health insurance. I felt like I was in a really good place and safe, and I had access to Netflix, and things were okay for a good long period of time. And the money wasn’t that big of a deal for me because I’d been saving thanks to good friends and mentors in my life who taught me how to run a business. And so, I was in a good position. I had an employee working for me, and I continued to pay her, and it was all right.
And I would say maybe the summer of 2021 is when things started to get a little old for me. So over a year into it, for me, it just became like Groundhog Day over and over again. And all the political strife was getting to me. And I don’t know. I would say the summer of 2021 is when things really took a turn for me. But I wonder, how did you do in the early days? How did you feel? You have a family, so it’s a completely different experience.
Don MacPherson:
Challenged at first when school shut down, and we were in a pretty small condo, 1200 square feet, four people, and then the amenities shut down. So it was challenging for the first six weeks, and then school started back up again. So that was a bit of a relief. But as you know, it was difficult. People were saying, “It’ll be two weeks, right? And then this is going to pass.” And then it’s six weeks. And then it’s three months. And then the summer of 2020 is when George Floyd was killed three miles from where we live. And that was challenging for many, many reasons and sad. There was great despair in our community, and we seemed to start to get through that. And COVID just didn’t end. And so I would say, I feel really fortunate to have my family and to be able to make a living still. So other than the starts and stops, I would say we’ve been able to weather this pretty well, but I am fatigued. I am ready to move on and start to resume a little bit of the life that we had prior to this.
Laurie Ruettimann:
That is good. That is good. Well, over the summer, I started feeling like it was Groundhog Day in my life, and it was. Every day I wake up, I do the same seven things and see the same three people and work out, but wear a mask. And it was just starting to get to me and my cat, Emma, got sick in September. And I don’t think of my animals as children. You know me, I love them, but they’re definitely animals. They bite, they poop, they do all the things, right? But she was something else. I got Emma right as I was leaving Pfizer, so back in 2007. And she was so cute. She was tossed out of a car as a kitten. And you think humanity is terrible, but for every action, there’s an equal and opposite reaction. Humanity stopped.
And people got out of their cars and rescued her. So this big thing that happened to this poor little kitten. She was taken to my vet, and they called me and said, “Would you foster her?” And I thought, “No, I’ll just keep her.” She’s so cute. She was just a sweet, little, selfless kitten. I mean, she had health challenges, but they were mostly managed. But then she started losing weight. And when a chubby animal loses weight, something’s wrong, right? So we took her to the vet, and she had something called pancreatitis, which is very painful.
And I know this because my mom has had it three times and survived. And it took a lot to get my mom to survive through these pancreatic attacks. And Emma wasn’t so lucky. She was in a lot of pain, lost a lot of weight. And even though my mom got a second, a third, a fourth chance, Emma didn’t, and we had to euthanize her. And the selfish thing for me to do would’ve been to keep my favorite cat alive because I love her. And maybe we could try something else, but I couldn’t do that to her. And so it was early October, mid-October, when all of this was happening, and I just thought, “All right, COVID, you’ve taken away my career. My book tour never happened. I’m seeing the same four people every single day, and now you’re going to take my favorite cat.” And I wouldn’t say I lost it, but I was pretty upset. For the first time in two years or a year and a half at that point, felt grief.
And it just made me shut down for a couple of months. I didn’t want to talk to anybody, didn’t want to go anywhere. And I don’t know. I just did not feel grief like that.
Don MacPherson:
Would you call it depression, or how would you categorize that?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, I like to call it a funk because I have a vision of depression. I mean, in my own life and with other people where you can’t function, you can’t get out of bed. And I functioned, I got out of bed, but I definitely had a POV of the world that was more cynical than normal. And I just didn’t want to suffer through any unnecessary conversations or make small talk or listen to people’s BS. And I even didn’t want to talk about my own BS because here I am, sad about a cat, sad about the world, and there’s true suffering in the world. I mean, none of it made sense. So I just thought, “You know what? I’m going to keep my footprint real small and leave people alone and ask to be left alone.” And if that’s depression, that’s depression, but I think it was more of a funk. But you can’t live like that for a long time, Don. Friendships suffer, relationships suffer. We didn’t talk for an extended period of time, and I don’t know.
Don MacPherson:
Had you ever felt like this before?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yes, actually. Worse even, when I was working at Pfizer.
Don MacPherson:
Was that a depression, or was that a funk? That was depression.
Laurie Ruettimann:
No, that was depression. That was definitely depression. Although I could function, I was not functioning well and not doing myself any favors.
Don MacPherson:
You are much younger than those. So would it have been a funk in present day? If that makes sense. Does that make sense? You have more coping abilities, right?
Laurie Ruettimann:
I do. Yeah. I’m smarter. I’ve done more work on myself. Yeah. I don’t know. That’s a great question. But I do think age, wisdom, experience season of life, I knew at some point I just needed to call somebody, and mental health resources are taxed right now. I mean, it’s interesting because traditional therapists are turning away business. They’re saying no. But yet, I reached out to the EAP, and they were Johnny-on-the-spot and actually talked about utilization rates not being incredibly high right now, not as high as we think. During COVID, utilization rates are around 8 to 10%. I mean, they’re not strong right now. And I feel like the EAP for me is something I’ve recommended for years and was just such a quick, smart way to get some help. And so I called them, but I’m so shocked that more people aren’t calling them.
Don MacPherson:
I’ve worked for two big companies in my life, American Express and Aon. And the Aon one was more of a transition. They acquired my company, and so I knew that I wasn’t there for a long time though I did spend 25 months there.
Laurie Ruettimann:
It felt long to me as your friend.
Don MacPherson:
Well, the first year was not long. The second year was longer.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah. Fair. Fair.
Don MacPherson:
If that makes sense. So at American Express, I remember hearing about an EAP, their EAP. I really truly don’t understand what it is even today. And I know that I’ve worked in human resources. So tell me what that is.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah. Well, most people know what therapy is, right? You go, and you sit in someone’s office, or you do a session or two via Zoom, and you talk about your childhood, and you go through this process, whether it’s you meditate or you look someone in the eye, and you talk. There are a lot of different ways to do traditional therapy. But therapy is long and it’s expensive. And it’s often trying to get to the heart of problems by looking backwards, often to your childhood. An employee assistance program is about getting someone tactical support today. It’s surface level, but it’s meant to be more targeted.
So an employee assistance program is something a company may offer if you are feeling stress from your job or stress from a broken relationship. And the EAP can give you light therapy, or they can work to find you a therapist, but you often get three free sessions, and you can talk to someone about what you’re thinking, how you’re feeling, your sensations. And sometimes those three sessions are enough, and sometimes they’re not. But they’re free, you don’t have to utilize your health insurance, and you never get a record with Aetna or Blue Cross Blue Shield or whoever your insurance provider is that you’ve been clinically depressed or you’re anxious, or you have other issues. It’s just light counseling in the moment.
Don MacPherson:
Is there a way that we can rebrand this because EAP-
Laurie Ruettimann:
Heck yes.
Don MacPherson:
… EAP does not sound like what you described. So that’s the first thing is-
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, wait, wait, wait, tell me more. What does it sound like when you hear the words EAP? What do you think that is?
Don MacPherson:
That sounds too broad that employee assistance program. I had no idea that it was really focused on mental health or personal challenges in the way that you described it. And so that’s the first thing.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, yeah. It is broad. Absolutely. But it also it’s intentionally broad because they just want people to call if you have a caregiving challenge, and maybe they can refer you to some caregiving resources or maybe you really do need therapy to deal with that. They keep it broad as almost like a problem-solving SWAT team to then direct you to where you need to go. So yeah, I can understand why you don’t know what it is because you’re right. The branding is terrible.
Don MacPherson:
The second thing is, do you think that people feel secure that this interaction is going to be anonymous or is going to be kept out of their employee records? Because I can tell you, for a lot of people, they’re not going to feel safe if they feel like their boss or somebody else within the company might know that they’re accessing these resources.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, that’s a fair question. I mean, we’re in a constant surveillance state, so your employer can know if you’re depressed just by looking at keystrokes. So I don’t think most people appreciate that. They know. They know exactly what you’re thinking, feeling, what you’re looking at through a lot of different channels. So the surveillance state is real. But the EAP is so disconnected, and maybe we can talk about the process of even getting referred to someone. It’s so disconnected that the right hand’s not talking to the left. And that’s both a good thing and a bad thing.
Don MacPherson:
So what do you mean by that? Describe what the process is like? What was your process like?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, I’ve called them a couple of times in my career. You can call them if you work in human resources and you have a difficult employee, and you don’t know how to deal with them. And that’s how I first came to know the EAP. They generally have a 1-800 number. And back in the day, when I was a human resources manager, I remember calling and saying, “I think I have an employee who’s suicidal. Can you help me?” And it triggered a process where they did help me. But in this particular case, I called the 1-800 number, and I said, “I need some help. I want to talk to someone. I’m feeling grief over a pet, and it’s weird. I’ve never felt this way.” And they had me, I kid you not, go online, create a profile, fill out the profile, say that I’m feeling pet grief and then call them back.
It’s like, “Are you kidding me? Oh my God, this is insane.” So I did all of that. I called them back, and they said, “Okay, we see your profile. Now we’re going to send you a secure email with a code to get on a telehealth platform for you to then make an appointment with a therapist, and you get three free sessions.” And by the way, in that email, the secure email, is a coupon code. And you have to copy that coupon code. That’s the only way you’re going to be able to avoid an $80 charge. So again, now I understand why utilization rates are low because EAP is super complicated, and I’m a woman well versed on the internet.
So the idea that someone would think that your employer knows exactly what you’re saying is insane because, by the time I finally talk to the provider, I was in four different databases and eventually ended up talking to a provider who took notes that I could get a copy of. I could see on a fourth platform than I started from. So the whole thing is just, it’s to your point about rebranding. There’s also a way to reconfigure this whole process. And I know there are vendors out that are trying to do it, but if you ask anybody who’s having an elite experience in the EAP, that elite experience is still similar to the one I had.
Don MacPherson:
I’m just curious if they did screen for suicidal thoughts or suicidal ideation, I think is more of an appropriate term. And if so, to your knowledge, would you have been accelerated, or if somebody is expressing suicidal ideation, would they be accelerated to talk to somebody right away?
Laurie Ruettimann:
They ask you 1500 times. It was amazing. The moment you’re on the platform, anytime you talk to somebody before you go live with a provider. So I would expect that on the back end, there is an accelerated pathway. Also, they asked about substance abuse. And I don’t drink, well, that’s a lie. I drink a little bit, but I try not to drink. So I’m not really experiencing that right now. So I didn’t have that accelerated pathway, but I would imagine that if you’re going through an experience in COVID where you’re lonely, you’re isolated, you’re having suicidal ideations, or you’re having substance abuse, maybe you get more of a concierge experience. But if you’re Laurie Ruettimann and you miss Emma, and you’re hating people, you got to jump through hoops, which is fine. I’m grateful for it, but it was still kind of crazy.
Don MacPherson:
How did your experience go? Did you use all three sessions, and what was the outcome?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, I did. So I could probably use regular therapy just to deal with ongoing issues around cynicism and my general POV in the world. But I did use those three sessions, and I was reminded of a couple of things. Number one, I always say we fix work by fixing ourselves first. And here I am going through the world, and I had lost touch with that continuous improvement that I want with other people. I’d also developed a hyperfocus on work because it’s COVID, also in response to Emma probably, and in response to just this being a crazy season of my life where I’m trying to sell books, right? I was really invested in that. And I was reminded that my work is not my worth. And so yeah, those three sessions were great.
And the other thing is I was reminded that the stuff I teach to people, I can use as well. I often ask people in coaching sessions to just be comfortable with saying, “I’m upset right now. I’m sad. I’m angry.” And I had not been doing that on my own. I had not been labeling my feelings. And so I’d been crying. I’d been pretty off. I’d been slamming dishes and things like that when I’m irritated. But I couldn’t say I was sad about Emma, which is, I don’t know, kind of sad for me because I’m a teacher. So I got to be a student on is what I’m telling you.
Don MacPherson:
Well, it’s so interesting we’re having this conversation today because, on Friday, I was in Annapolis, Maryland, interviewing a Major in the United States Marine Corps. And the conversation we had, was around leading through loss. Under her command, one of her Marines committed suicide. And we talked about a lot of the things that you and I are talking about today. And I asked, “How do you lead through this loss? And then how do you avoid it in the future?” And she talked about what you are doing right now, and that is being vulnerable, telling other people that it’s okay. It’s okay to be depressed. It’s okay to be sad. It’s okay to admit that you’re having challenges because when you do that, then others realize it’s safe for them to do it as well. And when they do that, then they’re more willing to access their EAP or a counselor or somebody they trust, a mentor or whatever. So I think what you’re doing is really, really important.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, thank you. It’s weird that we are talking about this because just over the past three months, I can’t tell you how many times I’ve lectured people about using their EAP and telling HR professionals, “If you don’t use it, how can you expect other people to use it,” while not using it myself, being a hypocrite. And that’s the strange thing about this time during COVID. There’s a lot of, I don’t know, performative acts of self-care and not enough true, authentic vulnerability. And I thought, “Who am I to spend one more day lecturing people about taking care of themselves when I’m so angry? And I’m so sad. And when I’m grieving Emma, and what I’m really grieving is just the loss of normalcy manifested in this cute punchy kitten. Who am I to tell another HR professional that their employee experience is a leading indicator of other people’s employee experiences if my own experience in the world is terrible? I got to act on this. I’ve got to be a leader.”
So I just couldn’t take it another day. And I’m so glad that there are other leaders out there being vulnerable as well. That gives me some comfort.
Don MacPherson:
Are you over this funk or almost over it? Where do you stand right now?
Laurie Ruettimann:
I’ve been able to reframe something which was really important to come to this position, which is although COVID was terrible, and I lost my cat, I got to spend every day of her life with her over the past year and a half. And I would not have done that without COVID. I would’ve been on the road and going to stupid conferences and dealing with clients that I don’t like. And instead, I was home every single day for the last year and a half of Emma’s life. I got to see her. I got to hold her. I can still feel the weight of her in my arms because I got to hold her so much. That feeling has not yet left me.
And I’m so grateful for COVID in that way. And that’s a discovery that I had through the EAP. And I have another old ass cat, right? Her name is Molly, and I’ve had her since she was eight weeks old herself. In fact, I got her at the very beginning of my time at Pfizer in 2004. And she’s on a limited path. She’s not going to be around forever. And now I’m spending every day of Molly’s life with her right now because of COVID. And that’s, in a weird way, beautiful. So yeah, being able to reframe that was such a gift I’m so grateful for. And that’s what the EAP did for me.
Don MacPherson:
This is your 200th episode of your podcast. You released a book. What’s next for you?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Don, I need to go on vacation. A real vacation. I need to go somewhere nice. Ken and I were just talking about it because if the world is truly opening up and we can do this, and things are a little bit safer, we should aim big. And this year is my 20th wedding anniversary. There’s a lot of really good stuff happening. And I think a vacation is in the cards for the Ruettimann family. How about you? I mean, it’s not like you’re a slouch. Your podcast is on fire. You’ve got another season coming up. What’s next for you?
Don MacPherson:
Well, monetizing the podcast is one of the things. I’m taking on more clients, which is a lot of fun. But that’s on the work front. I have been very fortunate over these last two years to become really, really close to my two daughters. And we haven’t had the opportunity to travel like we would normally. So we do have a few trips coming up. I’m going to London with them in April, and then we’ll go to Denmark in July. And then I’m taking my youngest daughter, who will be four at the time to Germany, where I lived in Germany. She and I are going there in November. So I want to-.
Laurie Ruettimann:
And you did that with your oldest daughter once, correct?
Don MacPherson:
I did. Yes. She’s six. And we did it when she was three and a half or so. So those are pretty special experiences. And that’s it. Well, I’m in the process of starting a new nonprofit called Leadership Garden, which will roll out this summer. And it’s helping young people become leaders by showing them experiences, educating them, and then providing them with service opportunities.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, and one of the things that has really impressed me about your journey as an entrepreneur, as a leader, is that you haven’t walked away. A lot of people would build a company, sell it and then just disappear, right? They would just be selfish. And instead, you’ve really spent the past couple of years focused on giving back to your community. Being an entrepreneur, but also helping others learn leadership skills, helping others learn how to be, frankly, better human beings. That’s what this is all about. So why do you do what you do? Why don’t you just retire?
Don MacPherson:
Because I have gifts to provide, and it’s extraordinarily fulfilling to see people learn and grow and become the best human being they can become. I’ve seen it in myself. I’m a much different person than I was 20 or 30 years ago. And I want to share these lessons with other people because had I not had a handful of really, really good mentors, I may not be where I am today. I might not have had the success that I’ve had. I may not have the happiness that I have or the family that I have. And so, I want others to have that opportunity as well. And there are just some people who simply don’t have opportunities. And if I can, through my resources and through my network, provide them with opportunity and allow them to pursue it, that’s great. That gives me incredible fulfillment.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, I’m really grateful to spend a little bit of time with you on this very special episode. I feel like it was an after-school special.
Don MacPherson:
Is there anything else that you want the audience to know?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, I really want people to know that there’s no cavalry coming. There’s no change that’s going to happen through someone else in their own individual lives. That any change they want, they can have. They can achieve their goals. But it starts with their own ability to say, “I need help, or I want something different,” and then to go out and get those resources to get assistance, but to get the ball rolling. I wrote about this embedding on you. I’m always so inspired by someone like Barack Obama, who’s like, “There’s no cavalry coming. You need to be the change you wish to see in the world,” right? That’s Gandhi. That’s Nelson Mandela. You are the change you’ve been waiting for. And that’s so true.
And just this little act of going to the EAP, I think, certainly makes me a better partner around the house, makes me a better business leader. But it just makes me a better human being, a better cat mom, a better friend, a better individual. I lost touch with that, but I’m glad to be back on the right path. And I want other people to be on that path as well. So that’s what I hope they hear in this conversation.
Don MacPherson:
I think it came through loud and clear. And I just want to share one thing before we go because it might be helpful. I love you. I’m grateful you’re my friend. And I simply wish more people would tell the people in their lives how much they mean to them and that they do love them. I try to tell you every time we talk, but I do love you. And I’m grateful that you shared this with us.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Thank you. And I love you back. It’s been one of the highlights of my life that we’re friends. I’m really grateful for it. And thanks again for coming on Punk Rock HR.
Don MacPherson:
You’re welcome.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Hey everybody. I hope you enjoyed this episode of Punk Rock HR. We are proudly underwritten by The Starr Conspiracy. The Starr Conspiracy is the B2B marketing agency for innovative brands creating the future of workplace solutions. For more information, head on over to thestarrconspiracy.com. Punk Rock HR is produced and edited by Rep Cap with special help from Michael Thibodeaux and Devon McGrath. For more information, show notes, links, and resources, head on over to punkrockhr.com. Now, that’s all for today, and I hope you enjoyed it. We’ll see you next time on Punk Rock HR.
You must be logged in to post a comment.