In this episode, my guest is the Rev. Wendy Hamilton. She is based in Washington, D.C., and is an activist, minister and mother who is holding workshops on grief and trauma in the age of civil unrest. We are connected through serial entrepreneur Andrew Yang, a previous guest on the show. Rev. Wendy and I talk about God, grief, and so much more.
Rev. Wendy and I have a common belief that your work is not your worth, and if you never work another day in your life, you still deserve housing, food, medical care and the ability to live a life with dignity. But the real reason why I asked Rev. Wendy to come on the podcast is to talk about what she calls the “storm before the calm” — the process of taking recurring problems, actually tackling the root cause of what’s happening, and learning to get through it to get to a place where there is social justice.
And now Rev. Wendy is taking her for social justice to the next level. Rev. Wendy has announced her run for Congress. She is a Candidate for the Washington D.C. Delegate and is ready to bring your commitment of justice for all on a larger scale.
So if you are interested in an episode that covers work, power, politics, money, race and God, sit back and enjoy my conversation with Rev. Wendy.
Punk Rock HR Episode 114:
Reverend Wendy Hamilton joins me to talk about the storm before the calm. In other words, the process of dealing with recurring problems and tackling the root cause of what’s happening in our society, to get to a place of social justice. Reverend Wendy is a D.C. area activist, minister, and mother who’s holding workshops on grief and trauma in the age of civil unrest. Wendy helps us work through grief, addresses faith, and the intersection of the two. This episode covers power, politics, money, race, and God. Yes, we cover a lot. I hope you enjoy our conversation.
Meeting Everyone’s Basic Needs
The world has gone through and is amidst uncertainty and unrest. In recent years, there has been a call for businesses and leaders to pay more attention to the basic needs of our society.
Rev. Wendy and I connected over our love and admiration for Andrew Yang and his enthusiasm for universal basic income, which he brought forth as part of his presidential run in 2020. At the time, Andrew expressed that we had strayed away from taking care of people and were focusing on the wrong things, and it was that article truly spoke to Rev. Wendy.
“It spoke to my heart because, in Ohio where I grew up, my grandmother worked at the shoe factory. My grandfather worked at the atomic plant, and we made a pretty decent living. $17-18 an hour in the ’70s is pretty good money,” she says. “And I thought to myself, when those jobs got automated away or shipped overseas, there was nothing that came in to replace them. And I thought if they had had at least a guarantee of a thousand dollars a month coming in, what a difference that would’ve made for them.”
She felt that someone finally acknowledged the problem and offered tangible solutions to let people know that they were seen and not forgotten. To Rev. Wendy, it’s about having the courage to acknowledge what is going on and prevent people from falling through the cracks.
The Intersection of Social Justice and Faith
Some people argue that we should keep faith and political movements separate, but they’ve never really been separate. For others, social justice and faith have always intersected, and for Rev. Wendy, that relationship is grounded in the Bible and manifests itself in our lives every day.
“I think that’s what social justice and faith is about. It’s more than just being about and talking about the religion about Jesus. It’s about demonstrating and walking in the religion of Jesus, and that’s where social justice and the Christian faith particularly intertwine for me,” she says.
Not everyone feels like they can see the presence of God in today’s world, especially in the wake of what has happened to Breonna Taylor, Nina Pop and George Floyd. It’s understandable how people can lose hope. “My recommendation might be that God be seen in the face of the dying George Floyd, that God be seen in the faces of those who are being denied justice,” she shares. “We’re called upon to recognize God in one another, and I think that sometimes we forget about that.”
The key is to think about this “from a less theological standpoint and a more humanistic standpoint,” Rev. Wendy explains. “I don’t believe God physically intervenes because people say that a lot — ‘If there were a God, why would all these evil things be happening?’ But there was no promise that evil would not take place. The promise was that we would not be going through it alone.”
The Journey to Addressing Grief and Trauma
There is a gap for many people regarding faith, and for many reasons. But one interpretation of a lack of faith is that it’s a form of unreconciled grief that’s manifested itself into your belief system.
Rev. Wendy says that pain and grief are tangible, and what she is trying to do is offer a safe space for people to validate that pain. Many people go into defensive modes and turn numb when there is too much coming at them at one time. Our brains are wired to protect us when a situation could take us over the edge.
2020 began with the hope and optimism of a new decade, but that dwindled to the point where people were unsure of how to proceed or if they’d get through it all.
“On the heels of the pandemic, you had the economic fallout and people losing their jobs and losing their way of living,” Rev. Wendy says. “And if that wasn’t enough, then we had the death of George Floyd, which erupted in uprisings that are still happening across the country in different parts of different states and in different ways.”
These events have many people dealing with trauma and grief, and we aren’t always sure how we should move forward. Rev. Wendy is working to help people feel the grief and work past it with her workshop. She hopes to get people to acknowledge the pain and grief to move on and heal.
“That’s what my grief and trauma processing workshop is about; let’s get to the bottom, let’s name what the pain is. Yes, you have pain, and most people just need that pain to be validated to know that it’s OK how they are feeling,” she says. “We’re going to sort it out, we’re going to lay it out, we’re going to call a thing a thing, and we’re going to name it. Because the way that we get to the naming is the way that we get to the healing.”
KEY TAKEAWAYS
WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THE ‘INTERSECTION OF SOCIAL JUSTICE AND FAITH’?
According to Reverend Wendy, much of what is manifesting these days as the social justice movement is rooted spiritually. Social justice and faith are more than just being about and talking about religion or Jesus. It’s about demonstrating and walking in the doctrine of Jesus. And that’s where social justice and the Christian faith particularly intertwine for Wendy.
HOW DO GRIEF AND TRAUMA COME INTO PLAY WHEN TALKING ABOUT THE WORLD’S CURRENT EVENTS?
If you’ve been frustrated, sad, mad, or in a place of numbness – you are likely experiencing grief or trauma as it relates to the state of the world right now. Here’s more from Reverend Wendy as to why this may be.
“Pain and grief are so tangible right now. What I’m trying to do is offer people a space to have that pain and that grief validated first and foremost. There are so many things coming at us at once. That said, almost all people are finding themselves numb. There’s a numbness that has come in because our bodies have defense mechanisms that protect us. And so if you look at how this year has started, all of the hope that was in 2020, and the beginning of a new decade and all of the things that we think about when we hit that new year. Then all of a sudden, we start getting hit with these major deaths. You know, Kobe Bryant. Then we get to mid-February, and you start talking about this Coronavirus that might be coming our way. Now, here we are considering that we might be entering the second wave of that. So on the heels of the pandemic, then, of course, you had the economic fallout and people losing their jobs and losing their way of living. And if that wasn’t enough, then we had the death of George Floyd, which erupted in uprisings that are still happening across the country in different parts of different states and different ways.”
In summary, we are all feeling grief and trauma due to these worldly events. And it’s perfectly fine and healthy to recognize the feelings you are feeling as such.
WHAT CAN WE LEARN FROM THIS MOMENT IN HISTORY?
We can learn to work as a team, build community, and truly listen to those within our communities and organizations. Reverend Wendy explains, “I think that there are so many opportunities at this moment. More people seem to be listening now. And that’s where healing, conversations, and dialogue start; when we’re willing to listen to one another deeply, not just hear. And you’re reflecting the person what it is that you are hearing them say. We just have to take the opportunity to build up our people. Some people talk about megachurches; sometimes, in churches, we worry about building megachurches, but we’re not building mega people. Same thing with corporations, with the youth and building corporations and megacorporations. You’re not building a mega team and a mega-corporation.”
People in This Episode
Full Transcript
Laurie Ruettimann:
Hey, everybody. This is Laurie Ruettimann, welcome to Punk Rock HR. This week’s guest is Rev. Wendy Hamilton. She’s a D.C.-area activist, minister and mother who is holding workshops on grief and trauma in the age of civil unrest. I invited Rev. Wendy onto the podcast because we are connected through Andrew Yang. And if you haven’t listened to that episode, I will have a link in the show notes. We have a common belief that your work is not your worth. If you never work another day in your life, you deserve housing, food, medical care and the ability to live a life with dignity.
Laurie Ruettimann:
But I really asked Rev. Wendy to come on the podcast to talk about what she calls the “storm before the calm.” That’s the process of dealing with the problems that come up over and over again, and actually tackling the root cause of what’s happening in our society to get through it, to get to that place where there’s social justice. This episode covers work, power, politics, money, race and God, that’s a lot, but sit back and enjoy my conversation with Rev. Wendy Hamilton.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Hello, Rev. Wendy. Welcome to my podcast.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Hello, Laurie. Thank you for inviting me and for having me today.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Oh my gosh. It’s my pleasure. There’s so much happening in the world right now. So I just want to pause for a second and ask you to introduce yourself to the audience and tell us how you’re doing.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
So my name is Rev. Wendy Hamilton, and I am originally from Ohio. I’m now based in Washington, D.C., where I came to go to college at Howard University and Howard School of Divinity. I am active in a number of things in ministry and counseling and I dabble in politics a little because I am in Washington. How am I doing?
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Phew, that’s about the best way I can describe that one, Laurie. There is so many things happening all at one time that I’m really just doing my best, like everyone else, to try to process things, not even one day at a time, it’s almost moments and moments in this environment. And so that’s how I’m doing.
Laurie Ruettimann:
All right. Well, I asked you to be on the show today because we connected over a love and an admiration of Andrew Yang and his idea around universal basic income.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
I discovered him in February of 2018. He had literally just joined the race, had just filed and they wrote an article about him in the New York Times, ‘The robots are coming’ is what it was entitled. And so I’m just gazing through the news, and it’s introducing this young Asian man who is running for the presidency in 2020. I’m like, “I’m still reeling from 2016, I can’t even think about 2020, but OK.” And here he was talking about he was going to run and he was running on the threat of automation and universal basic income. But he said, “We have gotten away from taking care of everybody. We’re losing people, we’re not paying attention. We’re so focused on Trump and the bigger reasons we think he got elected, we’re not looking at the data. And what the data shows is the Midwest lost jobs, and automation is threatening lots of jobs.” And it spoke to my heart, Laurie, because in Ohio where I grew up, my grandmother worked at the shoe factory. My grandfather worked at the atomic plant, and we made a pretty decent living, $17-18 an hour in the ’70s is pretty good money.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Oh yeah, absolutely.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
I thought to myself, when those jobs got automated away or shipped overseas, there was nothing that came in to replace them. And I thought if they had had at least a guarantee of a thousand dollars a month coming in, what a difference that would’ve made for them. Like, they were in despair. They did not know what they were going to do. They, too, slid into alcohol addiction. And so I just said, “Finally, somebody is offering something tangible to people saying here, we see you, we see your pain. We may not be able to give you much right now, but here’s something to tide you over. Here’s a lifeline to help tide you over until we can figure this thing out, but what we’re not going to do is let you simply fall through the cracks because we don’t have the courage to acknowledge what’s happening in this country.”
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
I wrote him an email. Then I was like, “Sir, I don’t know who you are, but you are onto something, and if I can help you, I will help you.” They wrote back, and that’s how I’ve been involved with them ever since.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Well, that’s pretty terrific. And I like the word that you use, courage, because I’ve done a couple of episodes on universal basic income. And a lot of people come back and say, “That’s just a handout. It’s just another form of the government giving people money and it’s not going to help anybody move forward, climb the social ladder,” as if any of those points are valid, and as if that’s what this is all about. But there’s courage needed to say, “We have enough money for this. We have enough money.”
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Right. And I tell people, it’s not a handout, it’s a help out. We used to do that for each other in this country.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, that’s right. And I’m helping out Jeff Bezos all the time by ordering from Amazon.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Listen, and he’s not paying a lick of tax. I paid more taxes this year than he did.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Frustrating.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
He tripled his billions or something over course of this pandemic, so forget about it but, yeah. And then from a safe standpoint, Andrew’s message around humanity first and universal basic income being available without being means-tested. That means we’re not going to let the poor be forgotten, that’s looking out for the least of these, that’s taking care of everyone, the oppressed, the widow. So I felt such spiritual overtones to what he was doing, too. I felt like this is something I need to also take to faith leaders and be able to communicate because so much of religion has been co-opted by the right in terms of it just being about abortion or gay marriage and things of that nature. But there’s a social justice aspect to faith that is also very relevant, and I felt like that would give some religious folks cover if they were willing to hear that perspective of Andrew’s message.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Here in North Carolina where I live, we’re really proud of the Rev. Dr. William Barber and what he did with Moral Monday was so multifaceted.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
He is just the best.
Laurie Ruettimann:
He is. And I want to know from your perspective, what the intersection of social justice and faith means to you.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Well, let me first again just say how impactful and what an icon, guru, any other superlative I can come up with to describe Reverend Barber. He is a prophetic voice for this moment. I actually had the pleasure of working with Dr. Barber for several years. I worked at the NAACP headquarters here in Baltimore, Maryland, not far from D.C. And while I was working there about four years ago, I had the pleasure of working with Dr. Barber. He was our North Carolina state director, and I worked with the President and CEO at that time, Benjamin Jealous. So I just want to plug that he is just as genuine and just as beautiful of a spirit in person as he is a large presence and voice on the stage.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
But back to your quest, where is the intersection of justice and faith? It’s in the Bible for me. I say that because so much of what is manifesting these days as the social justice movement is rooted scripturally. If you are someone who is familiar with the light of Jesus and the type of causes, if you will, that Jesus undertook. So for me, my theology, my Christian theology may be described as fairly progressive, if you will. And I am someone who honestly seeks to model herself and her ministry after the life and example that Jesus walked, out on the Earth.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
And so having come from an evangelical background and having an appreciation for that, I would look a little bit different in terms of how I interpret Scripture to implement it in everyday life, and I think that’s what social justice and faith is about. It’s more than just being about and talking about the religion, about Jesus. It’s about demonstrating and walking in the religion of Jesus, and that’s where social justice and the Christian faith particularly intertwine for me.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, that’s really interesting. I consider myself to be progressive and an ally, but I don’t have a faith-based background. And so for me, what I see out there is a real absence of God sometimes. There was no God for me in that eight minutes and 46 seconds, there was no God for me with Breonna Taylor, there was no God for me with Nina Pop. So I wonder, do you have a message for me? Do you have something to say — there are millions of people like me who would really love and appreciate the idea of God, but we don’t see it playing out, now and through the history of this whole struggle that we’ve had since the inception of this country.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Well, my recommendation might be that God be seen in the face of the dying George Floyd, that God be seen in the faces of those who are being denied justice. We’re called upon to recognize the God in one another, and I think that sometimes we forget about that. And so when we are denying justice to any part of God’s creation, that is a call for us, as people who are speaking a way to understand and to interpret what is happening. You can look at these types of injustices as an invitation to be God’s face, voice and feet on the earth, to be the ones who speak out for those who can no longer speak out for themselves. So you have to look at it in my perspective, from a less theological standpoint and a more humanistic standpoint.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
So while I don’t believe God physically intervenes — because people say that a lot, Laurie, right? “If there were a God, why would all these evil things be happening?” But there was no promise that evil would not take place. The promise was that we would not be going through it alone. And so I feel like we can find God in the places and spaces where we can embody what we believe God to be, and speak out and support and provide our insight into how God would interpret and intervene in some of the injustices we see that are out of our control.
Laurie Ruettimann:
I like that, really interesting. I once had someone suggest to me that my lack of faith is really a form of grief, like unreconciled grief, which is another reason why, when I saw you out there on the internet talking about grief and trauma, it resonated with me. So can you talk a little bit about your perspective around grief and trauma, and what you’re currently trying to do to address it?
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Well, the pain and the grief is so tangible right now, Laurie. Really what I’m trying to do is offer people a space to have that pain and that grief validated first and foremost, because there’s so many things coming at us at once that it’s almost — people are finding themselves numb, if you will. If you think about it, there’s sort of a numbness that has come in because our bodies, we have a mechanism that protects us. We have these defense mechanisms that, if there’s too much that we can bear — there’s a saying that says, “God won’t put more on this than we can bear.” I have questions about that.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Me, too.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
I’d like to talk to the manager on that one. But at the same time, I do believe that our brain goes into a protective mode when there are things that are just so egregious that it may take us over an edge. And so, if you look at how this year has started out, all of the hope that was in 2020 and the beginning of a new decade, and all of the things that we think about when we hit that new year. We make our resolutions — “This is going to be the best year of my life, and this is going to be the year that I overcome,” or whatever those plans are and the optimism that along with the beginning of the year. Then all of a sudden we start getting hit with these major deaths, Kobe Bryant, just some of these different things that hit us. And it was like, “Whoa, wait a minute.”
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
And then we get to mid-February, and they start talking about this coronavirus that might be coming our way, and lo and behold, here we are considering that we might be entering a second wave of that. So on the heels of the pandemic, then of course you had the economic fallout and people losing their jobs and losing their way of living. And if that wasn’t enough, then we had the death of George Floyd, which erupted in uprisings that are still happening across the country in different parts of different states and in different ways. I read something the other day that said, “Who thought that we would be experiencing the impact of the 1918 pandemic flu, the 1929 depression, and the 1968 civil rights act all at one time>”
Laurie Ruettimann:
That is well-said. Oh my God. Well, I am really intrigued by this idea that we’re all in a stage of grief right now, because that really resonates with me. And many of us when we’re grieving, we’re paralyzed, and paralysis causes all forms of toxic behaviors, some of which we’re seeing play out on a national stage. So you specifically are doing some work around grief and trauma, and I wonder if you can tell us a little bit about that and where that’s heading and what you see for that.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
So the workshop that I’m actually going to be doing this Sunday is entitled “The pain I feel, the pain I feel.” It’s a grief- and trauma-processing workshop because, what I have found, Laurie, is that like you just mentioned, a lot of times we don’t recognize that what we’re actually acting out, if you will, is grief. We might think that we’re angry, or we might think that we’re frustrated, and those may be a part of it, but the processing of it, going more deeply — we’re scared or we’re hurt. And so I feel like I have been — in addition to being a minister prior to going into pastoral ministry, which I was a part-time pastor in a local church here in Montgomery, Maryland, very recently until the end of 2019 — but prior to pastoral work, I was a chaplain, a hospital chaplain for several years.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
And for those who don’t know, chaplains, of course, generally come alongside, not just when you’re dying, but during times of trauma and pain and potential life-threatening illnesses. Hospital chaplains are called upon to come sit with families, pray with families, provide ministry to them or even accompany families to the morgue if necessary. I’ve had to do that, and I’ve had to sit and hold the hand of patients who are transitioning from this life to the next.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
So in chaplaincy, we focus on not just how a person is feeling, but helping them to understand it better in a way to care for themselves better. So that’s what my grief- and trauma-processing workshop is about, is let’s get to the bottom, let’s name what the pain is. Yes, you have pain, and most people just need that pain to be validated to know that it’s OK, how they are feeling. We’re going to sort it out, we’re going to lay it out, we’re going to call a thing a thing, and we’re going to name it because the way that we get to the naming is the way that we get to the healing.
Laurie Ruettimann:
As you were talking, I had two thoughts. Rev. Wendy, you were born to do what you do. By the way, that’s such a beautiful gift because so many people really struggle to figure out what their purpose is and then marry it with a way that they can be helpful, and you’re doing that. Have you always known that you were built for ministry, that this is what you’re doing?
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Not at all. Funny that. As I mentioned, I’m originally from Ohio, and growing up my interest was communications, quite honestly. I was going to be a PR, a Oprah or something, but as life would have it, I instead wound up majoring in education and human services. So that’s something that is certainly in my background. It really wasn’t until the death of my mother, my senior year in college at Howard, that I had a bit of an epiphany. By that time — in fact I was a senior at Howard about to graduate — and my mother, God rest her soul, had actually struggled with alcoholism. So addiction is in my background, and I do some work around that as well, alcohol addiction, but my mother had passed, and I found myself at a crossroad. I also found out I was pregnant shortly after that.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
So OK, mom’s dead, I’m a single mother, I’m just getting out of college, what is my life? So I sought out church, I felt like I had friends and family who were recommending that I go visit church. I hadn’t gone much other than Bible school and things like that growing up. But I went at 24 years old, and I just took my empty vessel into a local church. And that particular message that day spoke directly to me, and it filled a void I didn’t realize was there in terms of how it needed to be filled. And that started my spiritual journey and my journey into faith and led me, ultimately, to seminary, which it was there that I determined that, hey, this might be a life calling thing. I thought I was just going to feel better, but it turns out that there may be more to it for me. So I’ve been in ministry since that time, that was probably 2006 when I graduated Howard School of Divinity.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Wow. What a journey! The second thing I was thinking of, and I’m not surprised to hear you say that you were interested in communications and PR, is that so many businesses need a workshop like the one that you’re offering, need your services, need your skills because there’s much unresolved conflict, unresolved trauma between employees, unresolved issues. And we keep making the same mistakes over and over and over again, and we get stratified workforces. We get people fighting over 3.2% merit increases, unfair performance management systems, unequal treatment.
Laurie Ruettimann:
What do you think about all of these businesses that are putting out these PR statements around racism and equality? I don’t even need to finish the sentence, I can guess what you think about it, but they’re not living their statements. It’s so frustrating. Can you react to that? What are you thinking?
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Well, they’re doing what they think they have to do, or they think that’s what they’re supposed to do. But anyone who has been experienced, who has been doing this work, who has been living this life, sees it, unfortunately, for the superficial offering that it is. Because they don’t have to look much further beyond that statement to see that you’re not walking the walk. And so it’s more than just talking the talk, but it goes back to what you were referring to earlier, and this notion of what’s happening internally within organizations and within corporations. You know where that’s stemming from? It’s stemming from what’s going on internally with the employees.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
And so, yes, until I can make myself whole, how am I going to make someone else hopeful? So yes, 3.2, 2.1, that’s going to matter to me, but it has nothing to do really with the person that I’m redirecting my anger to. It’s harder to look within myself and say, “I feel like this is making me feel more unworthy than I already feel.”
Laurie Ruettimann:
Wow. Yeah, that’s right. That’s absolutely right. But I think about all of these leaders, and I’m using air quotes now, which you can’t see because we’re on a podcast, right? But leaders who are trained in finance, but they’re not trained in the human condition. And I wonder what you think ministry or what you think the social justice movement could offer to these leaders. I have some ideas, but do you have any thoughts on that? Because I think there’s a moment where they’re paying attention right now, and they could really start to think about the workforce differently.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
And I think that’s it. I think that there’s so many opportunities in this moment, and this is a moment. This is a moment. I’ve been around for a minute and this, we really have an opportunity. More people seem to be listening now, and that’s where healing and conversations and dialogue start, when we’re willing to listen to one another, deeply, not just “I hear you.” No, I’m listening. What are you saying? And you’re reflecting back to the person, what it’s that you are hearing them say. And we just have to take the opportunity to build up our people.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Some people talk about mega-churches. Sometimes in churches, we worry about building mega-churches, but we’re not building mega people. Same thing with corporations. What’s the use in building corporations and mega corporations, and you’re not building a mega team and a mega force. And I think Laurie, and this is a whole other podcast for another time probably, but I think there’s also some conversation to be had around people’s worth and identity being so tied to their work.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Wait, Rev. Wendy, I’m going to interrupt you because that’s what this podcast truly is all about. You don’t fix work unless you fix yourself, and you don’t fix work by instituting a program or a policy. In fact, the more you double down on work, the less human you become. And I’m sorry to interrupt you, but I’m so glad you mentioned that, because that is like the fundamental belief of everything I do. And a lot of people say to me, “Oh my identity isn’t intertwined with work, and that’s important to me.” And I’m like, “Well, you’re missing out.”
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
And I would love to blame society. It’s often said it’s difficult to build and construct community in a society that’s been rooted in rugged individualism. So we still need to work on that aspect of connected community to one another. But we have somehow also reinforced this notion that your value is tied to your productivity potential. And that’s not OK, because people are feeling — I’m not minimizing in any way the outbursts and the anger that people were feeling around the lockdowns. I know you saw that there were a lot of counterprotests, and we saw people storming the state house in Michigan that were armed. And they were like, “Let us go back to work.”
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
People from all walks of life were commenting. And I have friends on all sides of the political spectrum, and they were saying things like, “If we don’t let people get back to work, we’re going to have more death from suicide and depression and people’s mental health failing because they can’t work, then we will from COVID-19,” which is preposterous. But I understand what they were saying. But that broke my heart because in many ways I’m feeling like, so these people are probably not feeling valuable because they’re not producing. And how do we get them to understand that if you never work another day in your life, you are worthy. You have value to add to this community, to this world and society. And what you do for a living is not the only way that your contribution is defined.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Rev. Wendy, you’re going to make me cry. This is exactly the core of what I believe, and also the core of so much despair, despondency, addiction, dependence. You mentioned your mother, who had issues with alcohol. My father’s had issues with alcohol and he has not worked for the past 30 years because of that. And I just think it’s the chicken and the egg, because the more he drank, the less he could work, and the less he worked, the less valuable he felt, and the more he drank. It’s this vicious cycle, and he just never felt that his work was not his worth. It was just really interesting.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
It was inextricably linked.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Yeah, absolutely. Well, I could talk about this kind of stuff for hours. I’m really glad that you joined us on the podcast today. And if anybody wants to find out more about your grief and trauma workshops or bring it into their corporation, where can they contact you? Where can they find out more about your big ideas?
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Well, please just reach out to me. I am on Twitter @revwendy3, that’s my handle. Follow me on Twitter because I do a lot of my professional workshops and advertising and that’s there, but I also have a YouTube channel and that’s also RevWendy3 community of compassion. I think that’s where you said you saw my channel, Laurie.
Laurie Ruettimann:
I did. I loved it and I learned a lot.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
But mainly on Twitter and email, revwendy3@gmail.com, I’ll send out announcements in that about my grief and trauma workshops as I put them together, but the first one will be this Sunday at 6:00 PM via zoom, and I’ll be posting that link on Twitter later today.
Laurie Ruettimann:
I’m so grateful that you shared a little bit of time with us today. We’ll make sure we include all of that information in the show notes and Rev. Wendy, stay safe out there, and let’s talk again in maybe six months and see where the world is then.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Well, yes, definitely. Again, I appreciate you inviting me, and let’s keep the world lifted up. Let’s keep our film lifted up, let’s keep the world lifted up. We can get through this, we will get through this, but we’ll have to do it together.
Laurie Ruettimann:
I trust you. Thanks again for being a guest.
Rev. Wendy Hamilton:
Thank you.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Hey everybody. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Rev. Wendy Hamilton. For more information on her grief and trauma workshops and how you can bring that into your organization or to general information about her Twitter account and all the smart things she has to say, head on over to laurieruettimann.com. Before we close the show, I have a favor to ask. If you like Punk Rock HR, if you find that it adds value to your podcast listening rituals, if you feel like you hear stories here that you don’t find anywhere else, I would love for you to share this podcast with just one other person.
Laurie Ruettimann:
Tell them, “Hey, I know the title’s different, I know it sounds kind of crazy, but I think you’re going to enjoy it.” I would really appreciate that. And if you want to let me know who you forwarded the podcast to, I’ll follow up and introduce myself. Just send me a note at hello@letsfixwork.com because I love meeting new people, and I love especially connecting with new listeners. Now that’s all for today and I hope you enjoyed it. We’ll see you next time on Punk Rock HR.